The ol' "If he's turned on, it's okay" song and dance
December/2004: Society - So I'm talking to Fat DJ of The Pop Cult, whom most of you know from Monticello. He, loving to get my blood pressure up, linked me to a thread on ABrokenCrate.com where the owner copied and pasted text from a livejournal for people to comment upon. Basically, the girl was raped. No, not your movie-stereotyped "brutal rape in an alley", but she was raped. And as many rape victims do, she blames herself and her choices. This isn't an altogether unique or by itself, interesting situation. It's sadly commonplace, especially on American college campuses. There's nothing new with that. As callous as that may sound, I just cannot be shocked by such tales anymore, for they are too numerous.
I think the interesting portion comes in the responses to the Livejournal entry, where the old song and dance comes into play. You probably know the one, it's that little ditty where because the male's member is engourged, it's morally "okay" for him to push ahead, past protestation. I'm getting ahead of myself. First, for the entry, which was obviously poorly written in a state of confusion.
The girl was raped. Was what she did stupid? Sure. However, philosophically, we should all be able to agree that what we choose to do with our own body is our choice. If she doesn't want to be penetrated without a condom, no matter the state of undress or arousal, that's her choice. Was she stupid for having a fuck buddy to begin with? Sure. Was she dumb for feeling "desperate" simply due to inane arousal?
Sure. Yet imagine... you're hungry. You go to a restaurant. You tell the chef you're hungry. He looks at you with lusting eyes and asks you what you want. You say you want Apple Pie with no ice cream. He comes back with apple pie... but with ice cream. You say "no, no apple pie with ice cream, I want without." He talks smoothly, tells you to move the ice cream to the side... you cut off a piece of apple pie... and all of a sudden he shoves ice cream in your mouth. No person on this planet sides with the chef. Sure, he went to all the work on the meal... sure, most people want ice cream with their apple pie. You can't force that on someone. You'd spit it out, slug the chef in his teeth, and leave.
Once the woman says no, it's no. Doesn't matter how aroused the male is. You'd think that in this modern age, we'd get such simple and just principles straight. It's pretty easy. We all know the slogan, "no means no."
Yet on the internet, you can see the true mind of the modern male poured out on paper. And the responses to this scenario are interesting, not because of the scenario, but the lengths men go to justify such behavior. These guys aren't monsters, in fact a couple of them put on "Nice" facades. They act like normal people. But once you peel back the thin layer of offline platitudes and allow people to voice their whole hog opinion online, you see that these fairly normal males are indicative of this gender. No empathy for women, no respect for females. The worst part is, the minds of males have so poisoned society that even a female throws in, defending our unnamed assailant. Nothing illustrates better than a copy and paste.
Female forum poster there:
Female forum poster there:
Male forum poster there:
Male forum poster there:
Male forum poster there:
Male forum poster there:
Male forum poster there:
Are males disgusting? Yep. Are the female responses disgusting? Likewise, yep.
Here is the situation as any reasonable person sees it. Female calls over guy (that's stupid) for random sex (that's stupid) and then they get naked together (that's stupid) and then they start fooling around (that's stupid) until the point where she realizes that he didn't bring a condom (that's stupid) and then say's "no" (that's smart) leading to the guy doing what he wants and forcing himself upon her (that's rape). There is no justification. The fact that she wanted him pre-condom is not justification. The fact that he is turned on, likewise, not justification. The "points" made by these people show no grasp of nuance or psychological awareness of rape victims.
For example, the criticism of her posting the account on a livejournal? Makes complete sense. What's this woman going to do? Go run and tell her friends, who may react just as ignorantly as strangers on a strange message board? The blanket of anonymity is often very helpful for rape victims, hence the popularity of rape counseling phone lines. It is no easy feat for a female to stand up against such things, and reaching out in such an anonymous medium isn't condemnable, it's actually quite predictable.
The idea that because a female wants sex with condoms automatically means she should be forced without is stupid. Additionally, the idea that because she was conflicted about it means he gets a free pass on forced penetration is again hogwash. This person is obviously a troubled individual to be doing the things she's doing (fuckbuddyism is the surest sign of mental issues) as it is... but to use that to excuse forced penetration? Incorrect. It's akin to certain police departments refusing to prosecute males for soliciting willing female underage personas on the basis that the "little girl wanted it." It's simply invalid. It shows a lack of understanding in how females tick, and a lack of sensitivity. It's really unfortunate to see females toss their brains out the window and condemn the female, but not altogether unexpected due to the nature of females being so very catty.
The whole "She's a tease" opinion is really grating. That's the same opinion, when taken two steps further, that justifies the rape of women based on how they dress. "She wore that skirt? Oh my gosh, what a whore of babylon, what did she expect to happen?" How many females in yesteryear spoke those very words about other abused females? The process of rape is dehumanizing enough, but then to say, as a onlooker of sorts... that the person is a "tease" and not a human who is worthy of having their will obeyed regarding their body is absolutely bone-chillingly sickening. A stripper is a "tease" of sorts, yet few would... or would they? Would they condone the rape of a stripper for taking her clothes off and gyrating on a male lap? It's sad that I even have to ask that question, sadder still that the answer lies in doubt.
The opinions quoted here aren't of monsters. This isn't a board that often turns "rape" into a joke. These aren't sex offenders. They're modern males, and some females influenced by them. Not terribly unlike the males you would meet in a bar, drinking, being "normal." The most important lesson to learn from this is very simple... you're better off a lesbian. And if you can't justify that, then you're better off being as choosy as possible lest you end up with someone like the above quoted. Do you think such people and their lack of compassion will treat you well? Likely no. Opinions like the such expressed above are people who subtlely, hate females. Think of them as lessers. As objects to be exploited. Sure, it's not the most aggressive or disgusting description of a rape... I'll agree with that all day long. However, it's still a rape. It's still disgusting.
Often in life people will speak of shades of grey when it comes to morals. In some circumstances, there are other things to consider. However, when you start buying into the whole "shades of grey" argument and moral relativism, you begin walking on a road that leads to opinions like I've quoted above. Where everything turns into a muddle of grey, and morals are then dictated on the whims of libido. I don't think the people excusing rape should be hung or made pariahs, no... but the appeal is simple. If you want the true character of a male (or female), find these shades of grey and find ways to ascertain the true opinion of the target on such issues. If someone sags on something such as this, then they will sag on much... much... much more. Do you think that the person who can excuse rape won't find an excuse for treating you poorly? If so, then you're as naive as the people whose opinion I've quoted.
It's the same old song and dance of days gone by, rearing it's head again. Before, the condemnation was borne out of religion. How females should "properly act to be good Christian women." And if they didn't? Well, that's their fault. Now? We live in even a worse world, where no longer is it religion driving such stupidity but the opinions of a society so cluttered with sex-obsessives that now, denying such advances in a compromised position is seen as just as much the females fault as Sally Homemaker back in the forties when describing Judy Shortdress getting raped in an alley. We have come so far away from the dusty book dictated morals... and yet so little is different. At base, man is man and man is stupid. Whether the reason be religious fervor or sex obsessiveness, the conclusions never change. Same old song and dance, just a different beat guiding the steps.
In this world, the female is always at fault. Even when she says no and fights off the advances.
Amazing, how far we have not come.
I think the interesting portion comes in the responses to the Livejournal entry, where the old song and dance comes into play. You probably know the one, it's that little ditty where because the male's member is engourged, it's morally "okay" for him to push ahead, past protestation. I'm getting ahead of myself. First, for the entry, which was obviously poorly written in a state of confusion.
I did do something incredibly stupid. Incredibly ignorant and the consequences is nothing but my own fault. I was thinking, actually no I must not have been thinking.
I called an old fuck buddy last night. I was feeling lonely and horny and quite desperate. Call it a mistake in judgment, but I wasn't thinking past my carnal desires of the moment. Well he came over. We fooled around a bit and then started getting more into it. I kept telling him no, not without a condom. When he tried I'd clench my legs together and push him away. I kept repeating over and over again.. not without a condom. He told me to relax that he wasn't doing anything. Again he tried and again I pushed him off with my legs. He again told me to relax, and upon instinct I did. I've been with this guy before, no reason to think otherwise. He began his play, as soon as I would relax more and told him I want him, he'd try again. AGAIN I told him that I wasn't going to have sex if he wasn't going to put on a condom. Suddenly I felt him thrust in. I couldn't believe him. With all my might I kicked him off of me. I was so angry, I screamed at him. After slight ignorance again on my part I let him stay. I felt like shit and didn't know what to do. I wanted to cry and scream out. I'm so angry, so hurt, so so... violated. I let him do it to me for some reason after the first no I should have told him to leave, but no I relaxed instead of following my gut. It's my own fault. I was so scared too. I'm on birth control but I've never been on it before. I didn't know what to expect because it's the day before my placebo pills. I woke up this morning and rushed to call my doctor. There were too many questions I had for her. All I could come up with was a lie to tell her.. That I decided to have unprotected sex. I was so scared that there's a chance that I could be pregnant, yet she reassured me as long as I never skipped a pill I have nothing to worry about. No need for any emergency contraceptives. Yet, I have a small doubt in the back of my mind. I didn't even tell her the entire truth. That I had said no. I am at the point I don't really fucking care that it was unprotected that even after I had my desire for him and voiced what I wanted he felt it upon himself to do what he wanted. Like I was nothing, and because he was a lot bigger than me that I couldn't fight back. I feel like such a stupid idiot. I can't help but think I led everything to this. Nothing I can do, but my word against his.
I called an old fuck buddy last night. I was feeling lonely and horny and quite desperate. Call it a mistake in judgment, but I wasn't thinking past my carnal desires of the moment. Well he came over. We fooled around a bit and then started getting more into it. I kept telling him no, not without a condom. When he tried I'd clench my legs together and push him away. I kept repeating over and over again.. not without a condom. He told me to relax that he wasn't doing anything. Again he tried and again I pushed him off with my legs. He again told me to relax, and upon instinct I did. I've been with this guy before, no reason to think otherwise. He began his play, as soon as I would relax more and told him I want him, he'd try again. AGAIN I told him that I wasn't going to have sex if he wasn't going to put on a condom. Suddenly I felt him thrust in. I couldn't believe him. With all my might I kicked him off of me. I was so angry, I screamed at him. After slight ignorance again on my part I let him stay. I felt like shit and didn't know what to do. I wanted to cry and scream out. I'm so angry, so hurt, so so... violated. I let him do it to me for some reason after the first no I should have told him to leave, but no I relaxed instead of following my gut. It's my own fault. I was so scared too. I'm on birth control but I've never been on it before. I didn't know what to expect because it's the day before my placebo pills. I woke up this morning and rushed to call my doctor. There were too many questions I had for her. All I could come up with was a lie to tell her.. That I decided to have unprotected sex. I was so scared that there's a chance that I could be pregnant, yet she reassured me as long as I never skipped a pill I have nothing to worry about. No need for any emergency contraceptives. Yet, I have a small doubt in the back of my mind. I didn't even tell her the entire truth. That I had said no. I am at the point I don't really fucking care that it was unprotected that even after I had my desire for him and voiced what I wanted he felt it upon himself to do what he wanted. Like I was nothing, and because he was a lot bigger than me that I couldn't fight back. I feel like such a stupid idiot. I can't help but think I led everything to this. Nothing I can do, but my word against his.
The girl was raped. Was what she did stupid? Sure. However, philosophically, we should all be able to agree that what we choose to do with our own body is our choice. If she doesn't want to be penetrated without a condom, no matter the state of undress or arousal, that's her choice. Was she stupid for having a fuck buddy to begin with? Sure. Was she dumb for feeling "desperate" simply due to inane arousal?
Sure. Yet imagine... you're hungry. You go to a restaurant. You tell the chef you're hungry. He looks at you with lusting eyes and asks you what you want. You say you want Apple Pie with no ice cream. He comes back with apple pie... but with ice cream. You say "no, no apple pie with ice cream, I want without." He talks smoothly, tells you to move the ice cream to the side... you cut off a piece of apple pie... and all of a sudden he shoves ice cream in your mouth. No person on this planet sides with the chef. Sure, he went to all the work on the meal... sure, most people want ice cream with their apple pie. You can't force that on someone. You'd spit it out, slug the chef in his teeth, and leave.
Once the woman says no, it's no. Doesn't matter how aroused the male is. You'd think that in this modern age, we'd get such simple and just principles straight. It's pretty easy. We all know the slogan, "no means no."
Yet on the internet, you can see the true mind of the modern male poured out on paper. And the responses to this scenario are interesting, not because of the scenario, but the lengths men go to justify such behavior. These guys aren't monsters, in fact a couple of them put on "Nice" facades. They act like normal people. But once you peel back the thin layer of offline platitudes and allow people to voice their whole hog opinion online, you see that these fairly normal males are indicative of this gender. No empathy for women, no respect for females. The worst part is, the minds of males have so poisoned society that even a female throws in, defending our unnamed assailant. Nothing illustrates better than a copy and paste.
Female forum poster there:
1. She called him up to have sex.
2. She admits that after she told him No, she told him she wanted him.
3. She's a stupid tease.
4. Apparently, she did want sex, but just wanted him to wear a condom. She should have made that clear when she called him for sex.
5. She's a moron when it comes to the birth control pills.
6. He should have left her house when she started with the mind games.
2. She admits that after she told him No, she told him she wanted him.
3. She's a stupid tease.
4. Apparently, she did want sex, but just wanted him to wear a condom. She should have made that clear when she called him for sex.
5. She's a moron when it comes to the birth control pills.
6. He should have left her house when she started with the mind games.
Female forum poster there:
I think the blame's pretty equal but I agree with boog...she should only have to ask once. On the other hand, if she was calling him over for a booty call why the hell didn't she make sure she had condoms before she dialled?
Male forum poster there:
A better question would be 'why the hell didn't she take the two minutes out of her precious life to read the tiny pamphlet that comes with EVERY package of birth control pills which fully explain how the pills work, and the risks involved etc...?’ when she first started taking the pills to begin with.
Now originally I said the blame was split pretty much down the middle, with a wee bit more hanging over on her side, but after rereading the story a second time, I’ve had a change of heart. This whole situation was clearly 99.9% HER fault.
Now originally I said the blame was split pretty much down the middle, with a wee bit more hanging over on her side, but after rereading the story a second time, I’ve had a change of heart. This whole situation was clearly 99.9% HER fault.
Male forum poster there:
If anything the guy should be charged for having sex with the mentally retarded because I'm sure he broke that law.
Male forum poster there:
So she calls up an old friend that she has sex with a lot, tells him to come over to her place for the purposes of sex, gets at least partially naked with him while getting it on, and then when his penis makes contact she flips out on him for thinking he could have sex with her? Yeah, I'm finding it pretty damn hard to sympathize with this idiot.
Male forum poster there:
Raped? She willingly called him over for sex, willingly fooled around with him, willingly got NAKED with him, willingly let him get on top of her, and then flipped out at the last second when he tried to do exactly what they both knew he had come over to do. He got it in ONCE after she told him she wanted him, she kicked him off, and that was that.
She's not a fucking victim of anything she didn't call him over for in the first place. If she took the case in front of a jury, and repeated her story verbatim, they would laugh her out of the courtroom. This wasn't rape. This was a pathetic, and DISGUSTING cry for sympathy and attention, neither of which this girl deserves.
She's not a fucking victim of anything she didn't call him over for in the first place. If she took the case in front of a jury, and repeated her story verbatim, they would laugh her out of the courtroom. This wasn't rape. This was a pathetic, and DISGUSTING cry for sympathy and attention, neither of which this girl deserves.
Male forum poster there:
Here's the thing. If you feel like you're being raped, even though YOU initiated the contact in the first place, you'll fight and claw and do whatever you can to make it stop. Especially if you're with a person you know (in this case, a FUCK BUDDY). She let him do it to her and she RELAXED, and guess what, she probably enjoyed the hell out of it. I'm sure the moment this guy made direct contact with her clitoral area, her thoughts of safe sex went right out the window. This chick acted like a total slut, and like Megan said, she just wants to feel better about herself. Why she would post this in a public Live Journal is anybody's guess, but I'm sure the Attention Whore jpeg would explain it nicely.
Are males disgusting? Yep. Are the female responses disgusting? Likewise, yep.
Here is the situation as any reasonable person sees it. Female calls over guy (that's stupid) for random sex (that's stupid) and then they get naked together (that's stupid) and then they start fooling around (that's stupid) until the point where she realizes that he didn't bring a condom (that's stupid) and then say's "no" (that's smart) leading to the guy doing what he wants and forcing himself upon her (that's rape). There is no justification. The fact that she wanted him pre-condom is not justification. The fact that he is turned on, likewise, not justification. The "points" made by these people show no grasp of nuance or psychological awareness of rape victims.
For example, the criticism of her posting the account on a livejournal? Makes complete sense. What's this woman going to do? Go run and tell her friends, who may react just as ignorantly as strangers on a strange message board? The blanket of anonymity is often very helpful for rape victims, hence the popularity of rape counseling phone lines. It is no easy feat for a female to stand up against such things, and reaching out in such an anonymous medium isn't condemnable, it's actually quite predictable.
The idea that because a female wants sex with condoms automatically means she should be forced without is stupid. Additionally, the idea that because she was conflicted about it means he gets a free pass on forced penetration is again hogwash. This person is obviously a troubled individual to be doing the things she's doing (fuckbuddyism is the surest sign of mental issues) as it is... but to use that to excuse forced penetration? Incorrect. It's akin to certain police departments refusing to prosecute males for soliciting willing female underage personas on the basis that the "little girl wanted it." It's simply invalid. It shows a lack of understanding in how females tick, and a lack of sensitivity. It's really unfortunate to see females toss their brains out the window and condemn the female, but not altogether unexpected due to the nature of females being so very catty.
The whole "She's a tease" opinion is really grating. That's the same opinion, when taken two steps further, that justifies the rape of women based on how they dress. "She wore that skirt? Oh my gosh, what a whore of babylon, what did she expect to happen?" How many females in yesteryear spoke those very words about other abused females? The process of rape is dehumanizing enough, but then to say, as a onlooker of sorts... that the person is a "tease" and not a human who is worthy of having their will obeyed regarding their body is absolutely bone-chillingly sickening. A stripper is a "tease" of sorts, yet few would... or would they? Would they condone the rape of a stripper for taking her clothes off and gyrating on a male lap? It's sad that I even have to ask that question, sadder still that the answer lies in doubt.
The opinions quoted here aren't of monsters. This isn't a board that often turns "rape" into a joke. These aren't sex offenders. They're modern males, and some females influenced by them. Not terribly unlike the males you would meet in a bar, drinking, being "normal." The most important lesson to learn from this is very simple... you're better off a lesbian. And if you can't justify that, then you're better off being as choosy as possible lest you end up with someone like the above quoted. Do you think such people and their lack of compassion will treat you well? Likely no. Opinions like the such expressed above are people who subtlely, hate females. Think of them as lessers. As objects to be exploited. Sure, it's not the most aggressive or disgusting description of a rape... I'll agree with that all day long. However, it's still a rape. It's still disgusting.
Often in life people will speak of shades of grey when it comes to morals. In some circumstances, there are other things to consider. However, when you start buying into the whole "shades of grey" argument and moral relativism, you begin walking on a road that leads to opinions like I've quoted above. Where everything turns into a muddle of grey, and morals are then dictated on the whims of libido. I don't think the people excusing rape should be hung or made pariahs, no... but the appeal is simple. If you want the true character of a male (or female), find these shades of grey and find ways to ascertain the true opinion of the target on such issues. If someone sags on something such as this, then they will sag on much... much... much more. Do you think that the person who can excuse rape won't find an excuse for treating you poorly? If so, then you're as naive as the people whose opinion I've quoted.
It's the same old song and dance of days gone by, rearing it's head again. Before, the condemnation was borne out of religion. How females should "properly act to be good Christian women." And if they didn't? Well, that's their fault. Now? We live in even a worse world, where no longer is it religion driving such stupidity but the opinions of a society so cluttered with sex-obsessives that now, denying such advances in a compromised position is seen as just as much the females fault as Sally Homemaker back in the forties when describing Judy Shortdress getting raped in an alley. We have come so far away from the dusty book dictated morals... and yet so little is different. At base, man is man and man is stupid. Whether the reason be religious fervor or sex obsessiveness, the conclusions never change. Same old song and dance, just a different beat guiding the steps.
In this world, the female is always at fault. Even when she says no and fights off the advances.
Amazing, how far we have not come.
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